If you plan on using A&G Hair Complex....

[Jacob]

...do you plan on using it with LLLT? Anything else..during or after?

I am going to use it on it's own..no lasers. I'm still waiting for responses from some companies on how much it'd cost to use their hoods 5-10 times, but I just know it's going to cost at least as much as another box of the A&G product. Plus it's a good 30 minute drive for me. And since, we're told, that the main point of using lasers is to get quicker results(not necessarily better)...I'd rather save the money for a future purchase of the topical(if it comes to that).

I've been prepping by using Elsom's NanoFibrin..will end up using it about 1.5 weeks straight, maybe 2(they recommend one week..then once a week). I'm also currently still using Juveline on the receded areas..as well as LinoCare all over..every other day at the most.

I'm still debating whether I should use anything after the A&G product is used up. ScalpXtreme still looks good to me, maybe after a month or so I'll use it on the stubborn areas, along with Juveline. For sure I won't be using anything else while I'm using the A&G product, and for a good 2-4 weeks after. Except for my volumizer

[Whoop]

No lasers for me either. I'd rather buy the package two times if I must. I find it too much of a hassle otherwise, lol :-"

[perga]

I will personally be following the instructions for "laser usage" Dr AQ gave us.

However, I have 3 balding friends (ranging from NW2-NW4) who have never used anything to stop their loss. I am trying to convince them to give this a shot (one is definitely in...). Plus my father is NW5-6 and he has never used anything either. If this stuff looks promising enough I may try to get him to use it.

I will be taking photographs of everybody on a continuous basis under completely controlled conditions (assuming they actually get on board), plus I have a microscope camera so I will be taking x50 shots of various spots on the head as well.

If this is a scam I'm going to freak out

[Whoop]

If this is a scam I'm going to freak out

Same here, lol. And if it really works the way they say, I'll actually start donating to charity.

[Melon Collie]

LOL Whoop!!! too funny

I've been thinking about buying some Z-Peel 30 and using it on my scalp before starting the A&G Complex.

Has anyone ever used it?

I wonder how it compares to the NanoFibrin that Jacob is using.

Jacob, How long have you been using the NanoFibrin and what is your experience with it so far?

[p__]

If this is a scam I'm going to freak out

Me too. And if it not a scam, I'll freak out too.

[cld517]

i'll be using lasers..going to try and dothe alure protocol..kind of difficult because i have a 5x 2 1/2" strip of lasers that i move 3 times..seems like i would have to do area 1 15 min apply solution laser 5 more minutes then do next area..

[SW2]

i'll be using it the same - lasers for 15 mins then apply A&G serum and then 5 mins of lasering...

I've been using Ducray's Chronostim product for the past month with little results (i realize it's early). I was planning on stopping use of this a few days before beginning A&G and then starting again a few days after the last of the 5 bottle treatment.

Jacob - any reason you're not going to use anything for 2-4 weeks after A&G? you think there's a possibility that interactions between other treatments might vary the efficacy? i'm wondering if i should do the same... hmm.

[hulihoop]

Hi guys,

I am definitely going to laser through the applications as per the Allure protocol Dr. AQ told us about. I made a laser helmet and have been using it for 7 weeks so I might as well use it with the A&G serum.

I am not doing anything to prep my scalp other than my current laser protocol and regular shampooing, including 2x/week with Nizoral. I am a Norwood 1.5 that has started thinning and only noticed it in November. Never used propecia or minox. I am hoping this treatment can really thicken things up. The 40% increase in hair count that William got would pretty much put me back to square one. I actually think that is a good question to ask Dr. AQ - is there anything we can do to prep our scalp to make the treatment more effective?

I will not be using anything immediately after the treatment other than lasers 3x/week for 20 minutes as I want to give the serum a chance to do its thing. If it works like it did for William I will take steps to protect what I have regrown.

I will be taking photos too and trying my best to follow P_'s photo guidelines. I am willing to share with all of you whatever results (including photos) I get. For the record I don't think this is a scam. I agree it seems too good to be true and I am fully prepared to not get as good results at William did. However based on what I've been able to gather about their skin care line these guys are for real and so are their products. I think some of us will see great results, others so-so. There are just so many variables to consider in hair loss there really can't be any guarantees.

I am excited and counting down the days till March 20 (our current count down number is 9).

[Jacob]

LOL Whoop!!! too funny

I've been thinking about buying some Z-Peel 30 and using it on my scalp before starting the A&G Complex.

Has anyone ever used it?

I wonder how it compares to the NanoFibrin that Jacob is using.

Jacob, How long have you been using the NanoFibrin and what is your experience with it so far?

I have no idea how NanoFibrin compares. I'll post what they say about it, below. I WAS using it when it first came out, then forgot to keep using it. I can tell it is breaking things down- peeling if you want to call it that. Scalp feels just a bit raw for awhile after using it..if I don't use rubber gloves I can feel the roughness it creates, on my finger..etc. I'm currently on my 5th day of using it again.

NanoFibrin™ is a unique high-impact non-medicinal skin and scalp care formulation suitable for people with hardened or fibrotic skin. This condition may interfere with skin's normal function as a selective barrier and may change the selectivity and responsivenes of skin to topical treatments or topical applications of nutrients. In addition, such hardening accumulation of fibers in a non-organized or cross-linked fashion can be a convenient incubator for bacteria and fungi, which acts to exacerbate the problem. Excessive bacterial infestation may cause or support skin irritation, acne, dandruff, and itchiness. When the hardening affects the scalp, it may perpetuate to the point that the scalp may not provide good support for hair roots; other skin may lose its long elastic fiber network to cross-link fibers with a network of wrinkles instead.
NanoFibrin™ contains keratolytic components which may reduce the dead layers of hardening skin buildup and give the skin a chance to re-establish the natural elongated collagen which gives it the elastic properties that make it look fresh and young. NanoFibrin™ is gentle and will not harm live skin layers. To support the process of building new collagen, you can also use our Giga-C™ with 20% vitamin C for synergistic and powerful combinatory attributes with NanoFibrin™. Together they may help shed old buildup and support regeneration of beautiful and elastic skin or scalp.

[Jacob]

Jacob - any reason you're not going to use anything for 2-4 weeks after A&G? you think there's a possibility that interactions between other treatments might vary the efficacy? i'm wondering if i should do the same... hmm.

I don't want to take any chances on any interactions....according to Dr. AQ not everyone sees results or the kind of results some have gotten, so I don't want to wonder "what if" and have to try it later on on it's own...and it'll save me some money- not using other topicals for awhile.

[hulihoop]

I should add that I will be ordering or my cousin who will be using this product as well.

[Jacob]

5 sessions at the LLLT clinic would be close to $400. Is OMG reading this?

[anton]

Hi all,

I'll keep taking 1.25mg Finasteride (1/4 Proscar) and use Nizoral on the days that I'm not applying the A&G product. I will not be using Fluridil or Adenogen during or after the use of the Hair Complex. I won't be using lasers. I'm also going to cut my hair short to maximise the absorption of the product.

[hulihoop]

I am a NW 1.5 but am thinning all over the top of my head so there is a fair amount of surface I want to cover. I have started practicing spreading 6mL or less of liquid evenly around the top of my head. Haven't decided what the best method is yet. Dropper? Just put some on my finger and spread it around? I don't have a lot of experience with topicals. Will also be making sure my hair is pretty short to help. How much area do you guys have to cover and what do you think the best method is?

[Jacob]

hulihoop... http://www.mouse-mate.cn/p4.asp

I'm so used to applying topicals..I'll probably use a dropper..have my other hand/finger right there to start spreading it around once a bit of the topical has been squeezed out. If it's watery you have to be quick otherwise it'll be dripping down your face..down your neck...you'll be shaving in areas you've never shaved before.

[hulihoop]

haha...Thanks, Jacob, that laser/lotion thing is crazy!

Since I already have 380 diodes on a helmet I think I've stopped investing in lasers for now. I think I'll keep practicing with the dropper.

[HairLossFight.com]

Hi all,

I'm the owner of this site and I must say that I'm as intrigued and excited about this product as you all are. I have been quietly following the threads.

Anyway, to those of you that are going to try the product, I would like to suggest that you take good pictures and track your progress.

I have setup a section on the site where you can create a profile for yourself and post pictures. It's called my.hairlossfight.com. It's not integrated with these forums, but I will be working on making it so that when you login to the forums you will also be logged into my.hairlossfight.com. This is an experimental section of the site that if it gets used I will gladly expand upon and integrate more with these forums. I just wanted to give you guys a heads up so that those of you that are interested can start blogging about your experiences with the product there (and on hair loss in general), and sharing your before and after pictures. I will make it so that there will be a link in these forums to your blog and profile on my.hairlossfight.com.

Anyway, if anyone is interested in this, please PM me and I will work with you directly to help you get setup.

Cheers,
Sam

[Jajo]

Hi Sam -

I too have been eagerly following the line of discussion regarding anything to do with A&G (thats what prompted me to sign-up to your forum)

This progress/picture section sounds like a great idea - this way members can have some control over the "honesty" of the photos shown so we all can compare real, rather than percieved progress/results of a given product.

Maybe a set of guidelines like P__ posted on the general discussion board for A&G or some form of it would suffice?

by p__ on Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:35 pm

If you are going to release photos, which I think is unavoidable, please consider the following:

1. Make sure the subject does not tilt his head differently between photos, not even the slightest.
2. Make sure hair length is the same.
3. Make sure the hair is styled the same way.
4. If the hair in the before photo is wet then make sure the hair in the after photo is wet as well. Dry before -> dry after.
5. Make sure the lighting is exactly the same.
6. Make sure the zoom, distance to subject and all other relevant variables in the camera and elsewhere are the same.
7. Make sure that no "concealers" such as Toppik are used and that the hair has not been dyed in any way. Also, clearly state so in conjunction with the photos to avoid confusion or speculation. This extends to all other treatments which might change the tint or appearance of the hair, such as copper peptides, styling products etc.
8. Make sure that any other treatments used by the subject are listed along with the respective treatment lengths. This goes for topical as well as systematic treatments, past and present. Subjects using only your products are naturally preferred.
9. Show photos of subjects who are obviously suffering from androgenic alopecia. Subjects who basically already had a normal head of hair, albeit a little thin, will typically not impress the average MPB sufferer, since the nature of their problem is considered very different. Also, do not use subjects with alopecia areata or any other condition unless clearly stating so.
10. Make sure the photos are clear, in focus and available in high resolution.
11. The photos must be of the same subject and it must clearly be stated so.

Also - since you yourself are going to try a course of A&G complex, are you going to kick-off the photo/progress thread with your photos?!

Jajo

[Jacob]

I'm thinking of wearing a rubber glove when applying it. I'm not worried about it getting on my fingers...it just seems if it has to be massaged in for 5+ minutes..I'd prefer to get it all on my scalp. But I'm not sure how easy it will be to massage my scalp/with hair in those areas...with a glove on. I use a glove when applying NanoFibrin..but that's just applied..not rubbed/massaged in. And NanoFibrin is not slick like other topicals I'm used to. So...

[HairLossFight.com]

Jacob, aren't you worried the rubber may cause contact dermatitis?

[Jacob]

It's never bothered me before..on my hands etc anyway. They do make non-latex gloves..if that would help...??

[Skydiver1970]

Eagerly awaiting delivery I intend to cut a plastic straw (you know, like using to drink a coke lol) to drop the complex on my head.
I assume it won't harm the composure of the complex. Sorry, if this seems a silly Q
Greetings from Belgium

[Jacob]

I'm glad you said "to drink a coke"..rather than "snorting coke"

Belgium..I've got a Browning that was made in Belgium. I think the barrel is too big to use as a straw though

[Skydiver1970]

Jacob, too funny Well, I stick to drinking Belgian beers to double my hair count... for the time being
Regards

[Skydiver1970]

Hi All,

Received the HC today I've been reading about massaging or lasering the scalp to enhance infiltration of the HC. The doc mentionned that the latter also increases scalp temperature which is beneficial for the application. Just wondering (you have the right to fall on your *ss laughing now)... I have a cold/hot pack I use to treat muscular injuries. Would it be a stupid idea to put the hot pack (moderately) heated a few minutes on my scalp after showering before applying the complex? Btw I have my hair buzzed to 3mm (39y male with receeded hairline and started to notice a very nice horseshoe pattern.... now where's my horse? )

KR,
S

[mrw]

Hi All,

Received the HC today I've been reading about massaging or lasering the scalp to enhance infiltration of the HC. The doc mentionned that the latter also increases scalp temperature which is beneficial for the application. Just wondering (you have the right to fall on your *ss laughing now)... I have a cold/hot pack I use to treat muscular injuries. Would it be a stupid idea to put the hot pack (moderately) heated a few minutes on my scalp after showering before applying the complex? Btw I have my hair buzzed to 3mm (39y male with receeded hairline and started to notice a very nice horseshoe pattern.... now where's my horse? )

KR,
S

Sure- why not. If anything the heat may open some pours and make the scalp more pliable and easier to massage. I'd say go for it.

[Skydiver1970]

Thanks mrw, I'll go for it tomorrow a.m. (hell, no one can see me doing that anyway, lol)

[Ryand2]

I apply the complex right after I dry my head and step out of the shower. What I do though, is turn the temp of the water up and let my head soak for a few minutes to open some pores. I feel like this is an easy trick for anyone who doesnt have lasers or any hot packs.

[Skydiver1970]

Hi Ryand2 that seems like a solid approach (btw a hot/cold pack only costs a few Eur/$$$ in a pharmacy for those who wonder)

[mrw]

yeah, I agree with you guys on the whole heat thing. I was told that the "itch" caused by the AGHC is related to the follicles being reactivated and trying to push the new hair through layers of oil and debris in previously inactive/weak follicles. I think this is why the heat and massage is important as it can loosen and move the oil out of the follicles and allow better penetration of the complex. This is just my theory of course. All I know is my head has been itching and tingling like crazy. I hope this is a good sign, but way too soon to tell.

[Melon Collie]

I ordered a 1.0 mm dermaroller off ebay which I plan to use prior to applying the AGHC. Also, a very generous forum member gave me a GREAT deal on a Laser Max 90...It should be here on Wednesday. I've been doing chemical peels on my scalp once a week for 3 straight weeks now. The first week I used Z-Peel 30% and the last 2 weeks I've used salicylic acid 15% which seem a bit stronger than the Z-Peel.

I've also been using grapefruit seed extract before showering and emu oil and/or coconut oil after shower and leave it on all night. Shampooing and washing with tea trea oil and seabuckthorn oil shampoo and soap. Hopefully all this will increase the potential for results.

The early feedback from Chore boy, Ryand2, and MRW are really encouraging. I'm tempted to start today but I guess I'll wait til next Friday when I have the laser and the dermaroller. I'll probably do one more peel before I start...get that scalp all nice and fresh!

Jacob, how is it going with the Fibrin? Are you starting the AGHC treatments soon?

[Ryand2]

Just an FYI, before I apply, all I do is soak my head under the showerhead and just turn the heat up as high as I can stand it.

[Jacob]

Jacob, how is it going with the Fibrin? Are you starting the AGHC treatments soon?

I love the NanoFibrin..although I can't compare it to other products because I've never bothered using anything else. Most likely starting the AGHC tomorrow morning.

[goten574]

Just an FYI, before I apply, all I do is soak my head under the showerhead and just turn the heat up as high as I can stand it.

I would like to know this and also wondering if very cold water can have the same effect as hot.

[justthin]

Just an FYI, before I apply, all I do is soak my head under the showerhead and just turn the heat up as high as I can stand it.

I did the same and finally got an intense tingling /itching after a hot shower and doing it for about 3-5 mins .